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Copyright © by David Vidmar
 
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I'm a complete Microsoft geek. I like Windows, I love .NET. It has nothing to do with religion or anything, it's just that I know my way around Windows, I know how to make them reasonably secure and they don't crash on me all the time.

Since I'm always ready to play with something new, I have nothing (yeah, right!) against thousand of lines of text in configuration files. So a month ago I went on a journey to Linuxland. Mono was the main reason. I wanted to try and port a small .NET program to Mono and Linux. I thought that would be cool... A simple game was just a test .

I tried some weird distros and after some 10 unsuccessful installs on my old Celeron I chose Fedora Core. It looked to me like Red Hat is one of the major players, and FC3 distribution one that would get regularly updated and supported. I Downloaded the 3 CDs, slipped one by one in CD-ROM and Linux was up and running. Impressive. No trouble with configuring partitions and I didn't even lost my Windows XP installation on that machine. It found all my drivers! I have never installed Linux before, but this was just a piece of cake. After that FC3 managed to update something like 7000 components, but I just needed to press "Next" few times. So it didn't bother me. I was really happy everything went so easy.

But from there on, I was utterly disappointed. This Linux stuff will NEVER work guys. You must be dreaming or something. I'm experienced computer user but I stand no chance of getting my chosen two programs to work on my Linux box anytime soon.

Mono developers didn't publish FC3 builds of Mono, just FC1 and FC2. And those don't work on FC3. (And FC3 is not new. FC2 is legacy and FC4 is coming out soon!) What are you, nuts?! Can you imagine that Microsoft would require different versions of programs for Windows XP and Windows XP SP2? You can run almost any program imaginable on very different Windows platforms. Windows 95 and Windows XP are totally different under the hood, but if you try to install the same program you usually have no problems. But in Linuxland, you have to find the right distribution and the right version. Just look at Mono download page. ONE for ALL kinds of Windows and tons for Linux. Today I found someone who has built Mono for FC3. Check out the difference between Microsoft .NET Framework downloads and Mono for FC3. No comment necessary, right?

Frozen Bubbles is a simple game. A really simple game. So simple it has a Symbian Series 60 port - it runs on  GSM phones! But nooooo, not on Fedora Core 3. This time there is a simple download, just couple different builds for different distributions. But after downloading main program I got completely lost with the dependencies. Again I need to find the right version (not too old, not too new) of some graphics libraries I really don't care about. What the hell?! I just installed 3 CDs of OS and you are telling me I need to install more stuff by hand if I want to run a simple game? No way. This just can't work.

If you are total geek with nothing better to do all day, be my guest, compile, build, tweak and fix your OS. I want to DO something with it. It's just OS, remember?! But let's not talk about me. Let's take my sisters husband for example. He has no clue about computers. He can barely read English! But he has a big heart and a lot of will. He wants to play with music and video software and he wants to download and play free games with his son (my nephew).

In Windows he has a lot of problems and he's calling me all the time. And I have to clean up the mess after him from time to time. But he does it! On Linux he stands no chance. If Linux wants to go mainstream, there is at least one thing that has to happen: only one distribution or at least 100% compatible distros. 

This way you have no chance of EVER getting on desktops of regular users. 

Posted on Sunday, January 16, 2005 11:08 PM | Filed under: Software |

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# re: Fedora Core, Mono and Frozen Bubble and me in Linuxland 1/17/2005 9:06 AM GregorS
You have to have guts for publishing this post ("This Linux stuff will NEVER work guys")! I can hardly wait to read all 100+ comments that you are a $&%$%... :-D



# re: Fedora Core, Mono and Frozen Bubble and me in Linuxland 1/17/2005 12:04 PM Mare
Well... I used SuSE for about 6 months when I realised I too spent more time tweaking the system and finding a good replacement for a win32 based software. And since I work on a laptop computer I had trouble setting up ACPI and graphics drivers so I could have an extended desktop on an external display. Suxs. Now I'm back to Winblows, it works most of the time. :) I don't really go deep to tweak winblows system. I use Slackware for my file/web testing server with no GUI and it works like a charm. SuSE on the other hand is quite a bitch when you try to update/upgrade and you have to find a certain rpm package (like Fedora) and that suxx. Gentoo... I had to wait 2 or 3 days for system to compile just to log in. For that 3-4% faster system... no thanks. I'm no Linux freak and I don't like M$ because of it's attitude towards business and source code. I hate virus/trojan authors who make my Winblows user experience a crap. I saw Macwrold Expo 2005 just the other day and I'm surprised by it's user friendlyness. Sure there are no great games for MacOS platform but that's why we buy videogame consoles, right? And I even realised I could do all the work I do now (web developement, databases, Java...) on a MacOSX platform too with familiar software. Quanta+ on Linux just did not keep up with my classes. No (well, almost) viruses, no registry, no trojans, unix based (yay, ruine your users account, just delete it and log in again and it's reset to default :)) ) and many more really cool stuff. And I do agree Linux is not for desktops (yet). You could get away with it if you're not a demanding user, especially if you're just a word processing, internet user and nothing else really specific. But i you work with some other stuff like .NET programming, games and such... IMO, Linux has a long way to go to be a really competitive desktop OS (serverwise it kicks M$ ass so bad :), but there is BSD which is better than Linux and... eh, the comment is too long anyway). cheers.-

# re: Fedora Core, Mono and Frozen Bubble and me in Linuxland 1/17/2005 12:18 PM David
Grega: I'm not trying to start a war or anything. I just wrote about my experience with the penguin. I think that Linuxlanders will understand. :)

Mare: I cmopletely agree. It's cool/cheap for a user that only need what's in the distribution. If you try to look beyond, your are in serious time wasting situation. Unfortunatelly I fall in that category,.

# re: Fedora Core, Mono and Frozen Bubble and me in Linuxland 1/17/2005 9:29 PM dejan
I read this article and I must agree with David. Personaly I am too lazy to install and tweak Linux, but I speak with a lot of friends, who are or were using Linux. In last year installation of Linux has improved and I do not hear any complaints from users. There are a lot of programs that can be set up and parameters defined in details, but who wants to do that? Personally I prefer so hated Microsoft Wizards, which guide me step by step to the end of complex operation. And yes, it takes some time to click over 10 steps, but still less compared to use help to try to figure out all the parameters of one command. I can fight with anybody because I am convinced that Linux will introduce more and more wizards as it will get more mature.

Another thing crossed my mind - if David could not run simple application, that explains why there are not so many viruses or trojans. Hacker would need to write as many different versions as there are distributions...

Another issue is always in front when comparing Windows and Linux - speed. It may be, but again - when Linux will get mature and the graphic user interface will get richer, when system will get all neccessary utilities and programs as Windows system has, then I would like to compare speed.

What I really like with Linux people is their community spirit and their will to work and to contribute. I am sure there are excillent genius and wizards out there in Linux world and they feel very comfortable, since they are still a lot to do...

# Frozen Bubble 1/19/2005 4:32 AM Mike Mariano
Mr. Vidmar,

The downloadable package for Frozen Bubble has not ever worked with Fedora Core 3 because the game requires an older version of the Simple DirectMedia Layer (SDL). Think of it like a DirectX problem. Like DirectX, SDL is used commonly by many programs.

I ran into the same problem you had both with Fedora and on Windows. Try installing the Windows versions of both Frozen Bubble and Gaim: Gaim installs with a current version of SDL and Frozen Bubble refuses to run with it.

But Gaim is optional on Windows; it and other newer SDL programs come standard with Fedora Core 3. Ironically, this leaves the zealously anti-closed-source Frozen Bubble team with a product that works easier with Windows than it does with open operating systems.

Luckily it seems like the Frozen Bubble site has been updated and a new version will be on the way. It is a fun, polished game and doesn't deserve to have outdated current releases.

# re: Fedora Core, Mono and Frozen Bubble and me in Linuxland 1/19/2005 8:56 AM David
MIke, thank you for you answer. You sure calmed me down. I know what pain DLL and libraries can be. And I also suer every other developer knows.

I sure hope that Frozen Bubbles site gets updated so I can run it on my FC3! I haven given up yet!

# re: Fedora Core, Mono and Frozen Bubble and me in Linuxland 1/23/2005 8:37 PM BaRtMaN
David, there is a way that all open-source programs work on any distro - get the source code and compile it!

There is a catch with commercial software and those free progs which don't offer the source code but thosew are few and far between in 'Linuxland'.

# re: Fedora Core, Mono and Frozen Bubble and me in Linuxland 1/23/2005 11:20 PM David
BaRtMaN, by point was that compile is cool and nice if you are a hardcore geek. If you are a regular user without programming knowledge this is way too complicated. Just think of your parents or someone that is just a user...

# How to get stared with Mono 2/8/2005 5:22 PM vidmar.net/weblog


# How to get stared with Mono 2/8/2005 5:30 PM vidmar.net/weblog


# re: Fedora Core, Mono and Frozen Bubble and me in Linuxland 3/11/2005 12:41 PM Unknown
Well, if thats what you're saying, you're not as much as a nerd or geek or anything as you say. I just installed frozen bubble on Fedora Core 3 with one simple command.
'yum install frozen-bubble'
Yeah, you go windows. But Microsoft can't rule forever.

# re: Fedora Core, Mono and Frozen Bubble and me in Linuxland 5/27/2005 6:31 PM Naim
All that has been said is true. Setup.exe will always beat Fedora/RedHat/Mandrake/SuSE RPMs, Debian/Ubuntu DEBs, and source packages. This is one of the reasons why Windows is often much more easier to use than Linux, and the transition between Windows and Linux is often a rough one.

However, the need for a more common, universal installation method has been recognised by the penguins at Linuxworld, and new developments like yum and apt-get make it easier than ever before to install programs in Linux. As the person above me said, use "yum install frozen-bubble" to install the game (make sure you're logged in as root). The nice thing about these tools, is that they calculate the dependancies for you -- if there's something that the program needs and you don't have it, it'll automatically download and install it for you.

Yes, compiling source code is difficult if you do not have the know-how, (1) because it involves using a terminal, something which is probably rarely used in Windows, and (2) if it goes wrong, it leads to frustration finding dependancies, checking the correctness of source code, etc etc. I used to be a beginner at Linux, and I used to go through the exact same thing -- sometimes it made me switch back to Windows for some time because I really needed the work to be done.

Some companies have even taken it upon themselves to produce shell scripts, which are a similar concept to the setup.exe if you like, which can be run, and the program will install for you. It can be written like a wizard, so if you miss those wizard installers in Windows, fear not, they haven't all gone away!

I use Fedora Core 3 and Windows XP on the same box -- Fedora Core 3 for productivity, and Windows XP for gaming. In the end, the system you choose will be the one that works for you -- if it gets the job done, it's good.

# Days of virtualization 5/31/2005 11:31 PM vidmar.net/weblog


# re: Fedora Core, Mono and Frozen Bubble and me in Linuxland 11/25/2005 10:35 AM zWaR
I know it's an old post and I also didn't read the replies, but the post is a product of an computer wanna be, who saw .NET once and thinks he's the dedicated computer GOD. So, mother sonny, tell me something, ever heard about computer arhitecture??? How come you couldn't install Mono, can't you read?? I see, i see, you're an `expirienced computer user`, but you've never heard about documentation, have you?
Btw. It must be really hard to run the installer, i mean you don't see install wizards (like install shield) all the time on xp, do you?? :DDDDD

And the gem of em all:
[quote]
Windows 95 and Windows XP are totally different under the hood, but if you try to install the same program you usually have no problems.
[/quote]

I see, you really ARE an experienced Windows user, writing such a bullshit. Ever tried to install office xp under win 95 (office is a microsoft product, remember)??? Or did you try to install a simple game (u're a game fan, aren't you) written for 95 under xp???? :D come on, wake up!!!

I really must say Linux is more powerfull as i could imagine. It blocks fools away of using it :DDDDDDDD

the second gem:
[quote]
I just installed 3 CDs of OS and you are telling me I need to install more stuff by hand if I want to run a simple game? No way. This just can't work.
[/quote]

combined with this one:
[quote]
I want to DO something with it
[/quote]

LOL!!!!!!! Ok, let me state a question. It's true, XP comes on one CD, but what can you DO with it??? (errrr surf the net? (what is extremly dangerous under lack of security protection on bare xp), or maybe using notepad or playing hearts). You are an `experienced .NET user`, please explain others how to install VS.NET. Ever heard about the updates for xp and DirectX? Do you GET this on the installation CD??? :))))) Please think once, before posting nonsense!

I mean, Linux is not perfect, it has it's minus points, but such bullshit upsets one. Solutions which "are two click away" are presented as all-day-surfing-and-dependencies-searching and are posted by a guy, who believes he's an `experienced computer user`!!
For an FC3 user (and please consider, we're speaking of an `experienced computer user`), installing rpm's couldn't be easier!!
It's true, nobody is perfect, that's the reason why are both programs well documented, you can read the documentation on the web, you get the documentation (if you've installed them from source) in the compressed file, i mean, what would an `experienced computer user` want more? On-line help in style of xp's remote control??
Comme on! Even M$, which is well-known for his anti-Linux propaganda is more smarter than that!

Oh, yeah not forget to mention this:
[quote]
If Linux wants to go mainstream, there is at least one thing that has to happen: only one distribution or at least 100% compatible distros.
[/quote]

tell me something? Are you able to install xp for 64-bit processors on a 32-bit one? Thik!!!! Another question, ever heard about kernel??? Now, think again!!! Haven't you?? Here (www.google.com), i wish you nice reading......... are you finished?? You SEE?!

# re: Fedora Core, Mono and Frozen Bubble and me in Linuxland 11/25/2005 10:57 AM zWaR
Hi, zWaR.

This post was dedicated to guys like you. I see you totally missed the point. And you didn't

You didn't answer my main question: how can I get my sister husband to use Linux instead of Windows. He has lots of troubles updating installing with installers. He'll never learn how to use rpms. And he doesn't have to. His job is to write emails and use word processor not using seven thousand characters long command line commands and compiling kernel. He can do that on Windows. And yes, he surfs the net. With Firefox, mind you.

Cheers.

# re: Fedora Core, Mono and Frozen Bubble and me in Linuxland 11/13/2006 10:06 AM Javed

Download Fedora Core 6 Full

http://freshwap.com/Apps/Apps/Fedora_Core_6_Full_200611071512.html

# Links of the week #6 (week 40/07) 10/8/2007 12:03 AM Bite my bytes
Links of the week #6 (week 40/07)

# re: Fedora Core, Mono and Frozen Bubble and me in Linuxland 12/17/2007 6:19 AM vivek
give detail of fedora core

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